My 2 cents HG:

There’s a pragmatic reason someone like me will turn down food that is offered to me. I turned down food when I had a home, and now that I’m within days of being on the streets, I still turn down food.

A person today who wanted to assist me offered me baked goods they had bought on their way over as they provided schlepping assistant to help me get rid of the rest of my belongings.

“Yes, thank you for the offer,” I said, “but I cannot eat wheat, gluten, refined sugar, or salt.”

He was stunned. I don’t know the demographics of who is actually on the streets, but I cannot imagine I (with my food sensitivities and allergies) can be the only one who would politely reject an offer of food. Feed me enough salt and I will die in front of you. That would put a damper on the day wouldn’t it?

I’m grateful for having internet at this moment so I could post this here today.

Good journeys HG.

Hey lost awareness yours is another brilliant point.
We often forget about these things.

Thank you for using your Internet to write this comment it was lovely.

If you still have time, I just wanted to know so wat are your plans are you going to be in shelters or staying with people.

And what is it that you need, items and support

My plan is to head for PathMall, the local LA shelter, I’ve finally come across. No one I know has room for another person.

I’m personally still looking for:

A safe place to house my seed grinder (small), my food processer (mid-size) and my blender. All items I will need and be unable to rebuy if I actually manage to get some transitional housing after being in 1-night emergency shelters for some proscribed time by the “officials” of said places. Someone is already going to house my Champion Juicer for me. They are vital to my health and there is no way to carry them on the streets even if I had 2 good arms.

A safe place to store my computer 2 base computer units and screens .. the data on them has to be wiped for me to give them to a thrift store or I risk identity theft.

As to hand outs?

Let me answer for those who have issues giving someone cash, or for my associates whom I won’t accept cash from because it makes either them or me uncomfortable (I get coin from a friend I consider it a loan):

a monthly EZ transit pass — it gives the most bang for the buck in transportation, including not only Metro buses but surrounding cities systems/carriers it’s $84
http://www.metro.net/around/fares/

a pre-paid t-moblie phone card for use with the little phone I’ve carried for years for emergency use only. It’s now the only way I can contact my DPSS caseworker, have you tried to find a public phone lately on the streets?

a pre-paid card for Trader Joe’s — I can get fresh food there and some toiletries
http://www.traderjoes.com/products.asp

A prepaid convenience card – Visa/Chase/MasterCard, you can pick them up at most Rite-Aids, Vons, Ralphs, Target, Walmart or other such stores.

A prepaid card for the public library for printer use or computer use.

If you’re going to hand me food, I’d rather you gave me a card to Trader Joe’s or Whole foods or another type of healthy food store. Fresh food rots quickly.

I also appreciate public bathrooms.

Not the sun, moon and stars, but thanks HG, I have been able to clarify so when I have a moment to blog on my site, I can put this up there. You rock woman.

It’s a very interesting debate, HG, and, as ever, you have been thought-provoking and written well and from the heart.

I questioned earlier your initial (pre-edit) use of the word ‘selfish’, on the grounds that ANYTHING given freely is not completely selfish. But, as the dictionary confirms, ‘selfish’ can mean ‘concerned CHIEFLY or only WITH ONESELF’. So not far, if distanced at all, from your settling on ‘self-centred’. In health care, we talk about whether or not consultations are ‘patient-centred’ rather than HC professional-centred’, i.e. do they take into account the patient’s wishes, concerns, expectations etc. , or come from a paternalistic (I use that word in a gender non-specific way) approach. There can be clashes where society’s greater good is served more by the paternalistic approach, but that the patient’s wishes are then trampled on.

In terms of self-centredness, it could be argued that there is a large element of this in ALL giving, as many give in order to feel better about themselves, or earn ‘after-life’ points etc.. But here we need to focus on the specific elements of self-centredness involved in giving food rather than, most obviously, cash. I would assume here that we are positing that the giver feels better about giving food, because that is unlikely to be converted into cash for drugs, which may include alcohol (I have a great aversion to saying ‘drugs OR alcohol’ as alcohol is, clearly, a drug). I other words, there are lifestyle assumptions and judgements going on.

I have in the past, in various situations, given nothing, given money, given food. Each time wondering whether my decision was the right one. And knowing inside that ‘one size does not fit all’. Now I work regularly with the homeless, I am even more keenly aware of that, as I have got to know so many people as individuals. In our project, it is, by and large the food that first draws guests in. But we are also offering a safe haven, use of washing and laundry facilites, clothes, listening ears, signposting for help, social intercourse, use of facilities to make music, art, write, use IT, use the phone for calls re housing, jobs, benefits etc.., and soon, play sport. Most of all, recognition of the uniqueness of each person.

Most of the needs will not be addressed on the street JUST by givng food. Some of them may be addressed by giving cash, or specifics as in posts 5 and 6. The giving of food gives no choice even in the type of food. We do indeed have guests with allergies, a topic mentioned in post 2, some are vegtarian, some are diabetic. All have their own preferences. We always offer a choice in the project. Those of us who are fortunate enough to be able to buy our own food expect to exercise our choice. Are we saying as a society that the homeless don’t deserve a choice? Are we seeking to punish them? Indeed are we looking to punish them more than convicted criminals, because they do get a choice in their food, and their dietary specifics taken into consideration, as indeed they should be.

So – we should talk to the homeless – more, listen to them, and see what they think ould help them most, and why.

Thanks, HG.

Calneeagle. Seriously no problems at all I love long posts makes the topic more engaging and I have to say what you wrote was incredible and just spot on and yeah I did edit it, because I did think selfish was a bit inappropriate and worded wrongly.

The bit about prisoners and homeless is spot on. Prisoners get better treatment, but I’m a bit skeptical about the future because unless something drastic happens in peoples thinking what I’ve written will still be debated 50 years in the future.

Maybe society thinks that homelessness is just another part of life like losing a job. I would hate to be right about that

Homelessgirl as I noted it all depends on where one lives. I live in the Sierras and the one man whom I help I know uses drugs as he says he does. So for him I only buy items etc he needs. Like la room in a motel, phone card, food card from a good grocery store. I have bought 2 sleeping bags which we rotate every week so he has a clean one. I have done his laundry so he always has clean clothes. And he is allowed to use the ourdoor shower at various places. This works for where I live, but may not work for someone else.

Do some panhandlers use the $$$ given to them from drugs and/or alcohol? Yep. You bet.

Do all who panhandle use drugs and/or alcohol? Nope… and anyone who believes otherwise doesn’t have the faintest clue what homelessness is, or the myriad of reasons it can occur to someone.

I’ve never had an addiction disorder. Yet I do know what it’s like to have been homeless. And, I also know the indiginities with having had to stand on a corner somewhere, holding a cardboard sign, surviving on the kindness of others – as well as the stares of contempt and having been the target of verbal abuse from some passers-by.

Do I give to panhandlers? Yep.

Will some of them use those $$$ for drugs or alcohol? Again, yes.

But, I also know that some of them will indeed use the money given them for feeding and clothing themselves.

Once I give them those $$$, it is no longer my money. It’s theirs – regardless of how “hard earned” it may have been to me. It is use to them to use it as they see fit. If I place conditions on how I think they should use that money, it isn’t a true gift.

Doorway, exactly. People think that by not giving £5 or whatever they are stopping the person from taking drugs but honestly if someone is an addict they are going to get their drugs but us setting parameters on the money only benefits us

Elizabeth try saying that to something who doesn’t even have a house or bills to pay.

And like I said giving money to the homeless isn’t lending like to a friend it’s a gift and when I give a gift I don’t tell my friend you can only spend it on this because I don’t want u to use it in anyother way. Then what was the point in giving it.

And when you give you don’t own it anymore and yes you’ve worked hard for your cash but no one forces you to give money, you have that choice an so if you give you have no right to make that choice for someone else.

Simple, hope you think about that.

@MotherLodeBeth,

I thank you for the thought, if I were in the area! If you come across anyone in the Los Angeles area of likemind, share me with them or them with me if you feel so inclined!

Lost Awareness, or maybe I should consider LA for short? grin

I understand the point of your discussion, but I find the post title to be very presumptive and over-simplified.

Statistically between 7 out of 10 and 9 out of 10 panhandlers will spend all or most of the money they get on their addictions.

Over 80% of the money given to panhandlers goes to this cause. I’d hardly call refusal to enable a “pathetic excuse”. Perhaps you’re so blinded by ideology and dogma that government and service provider data collections and studies, empirical evidence as it were means nothing to you.

Don’t bother to reply on my account, just go back to closing your eyes and sticking your fingers in your ears. Perhaps if you hum really loud all those nasty facts will go away.

As I said before, those using the money to fund addictions represent between 7 out of 10 and 9 out of 10 panhandlers – it varies slightly by city but it’s always a majority.

Also, just because I may choose to comment in order to correct a false analysis does not mean that I required further dialogue. I was quite content to allow the comment to stand on it’s own whilst letting the reader decide if it has merit. I was also quite surprised, I may add to be getting any feedback, especially on a topic 10 months old.

As for your “new way of thinking” it doesn’t stand up to the facts at hand. We, as a society must judge people everday, and with the available data at hand I choose to judge most panhandlers as addicts -because that’s what they are.

As for “trying something new” you make some good points but you fail to come up with anything concrete. It’s also quite dangerous and reckless of you to put your fellow citizens in danger. Next time you give out spare change why don’t you spare a thought as to what happens when the panhandler gets his/her fix and ends up beating or stabbing someone to death in a drug induced delusional state(as happened in my city).

Do you ever stop to think about your personal culpability should such a situation occur?

as one woman said below that reminded me of something else…….i had someone who would wash my clothes and sleeping bag for me, and that made me feel so normal, and human, and somewhat clean….and that was more helpful than anything….if she would have given me money, i would have just gotten drunk……..and yes that was my need at the time but looking back on it ( i am sober now ) and that would have caused me terrible things….such as chasing it all day and withdrawing so……an addict at the time is going to feel like they’re not getting what they need but in perspective…….the simple needs of food and clean blankets benefits so much more……i have seen a friend who did not get his liquor money, go into a seizure and almost die……so i can so both sides as well, because some times not feeding an addiction can be dangerous….and one may be living on a moment to moment basis….. and the whole selfish thing….i don’t quite get how giving food is selfish at all actually….that part  i can’t jive with….

I find your article very offensive and in poor taste, to write “you’re only scoring brownie points for yourself” makes me sick to my stomach. I don’t make a lot of money, I’m a member of the military and my wife is a Police Officer and I thought it would be a nice idea to cook a few desserts that could possibly feed hundreds of homeless man and women during the holidays. My wife spends countless hours of here limited time off with children from underprivileged homes teaching them how to read and write and for some how to speak english. You may be correct, they do need money but more importantly they need love…..love and support. 

As a member of the military I can tell you food is the greatest moral next to love. At times I would get care packages of food that I either did not like or could not eat but every time I received the gift of food I smiled said thank you and soon found someone that could enjoy the gift as it was intended. 

I guess what I’m trying to say is maybe baked goods are not a good idea to YOU but I can guarantee your wrong, and I cant wait to deliver my fresh baked cookies and cakes tomorrow afternoon on Christmas Eve to the countless homeless Veterans who are hungry and alone.

I have to disagree. The Toronto Star actually conducted an experiment by giving random homeless individuals prepaid visa cards to see what they’d use that money for.

Here the link:
http://www.thestar.com/news/article/854018–how-panhandlers-use-free-credit-cards

Of the five cards that were handed out, totaling 300$, 33.64$ was spent on McDonalds, 53.85$ at a liquor store, 21.64$ at a fairly upscale restaurant, 50$ unspent and only one individuals actually spent 75$ it on grocery food and phone minutes, with unfortunately cigarettes.

While your arguments might hold true to some point, what that experiment proves is these individuals will spend the money on luxuries instead of needs.

I’m not saying that wrong, but what I am saying is they’ll just spent that money carelessly. That 33$ that was spent on McDonalds could easily feed 30 individuals at a homeless shelter, and that 50$ on alcohol could feed 50.